Manky Monkey Motors

Technical Section => General Tech => Topic started by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:00:19 PM



Title: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:00:19 PM
Hopefully most of you will know what this is? It`s a swan neck from what they term as a "hobby" welder.
Now i`m not saying i get through a lot of these but i have just broke my second one by welding the wire to the tip and trying to remove the tip.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:05:40 PM
If you ever need to replace one, it`ll cost you over a tenner, i know cos i bought one last week.
Lets see what you get for your money, a piece of brass tube with a couple of threads in, some holes and a rubber sleeve, HMMM think we can make one?
First thing we need then is the raw material, 8mm brass bar, this will cost you that same ten pound note but for that you get a metre of the stuff, enough to make 6 necks!


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:07:31 PM
Measure the length of your old swan neck, should be around 140mm, and cut the brass rod to length.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:18:02 PM
Tricky part next, you need to drill a 4mm hole through the length of the bar. This is the part that had me stumped for a bit, but after seeking advice (cheers Doc), about the only way to do this is to drill down one end, then flip it over and drill down the other to meet in the middle.
Ordinary drill bits are around 75mm long (this is what i used)  but long series bits are available and would be better.  ;)
Ok OK, it did take me 3 attempts before i got this right, the drill bit had a habit of wandering off centre and out the side of the bar. SLOW and STEADY is the way to do it.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: TwistedPatience on February 07, 2010, 06:25:58 PM
get that bloody lathe running far better for this kind of job.

Oh by the way I made a brass tube up for you.

Will you be going to Wootten Bassett by any chance?


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:28:05 PM
With the hole drilled, the next job is to thread one end, useing an 8mm die to a depth of 30mm.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:31:23 PM
get that bloody lathe running far better for this kind of job.

Oh by the way I made a brass tube up for you.

Will you be going to Wootten Bassett by any chance?

Now you tell me! all afternoon i been on this  ;D.
I`m working that weekend, i think my first outing is the Monkey Nuts run in april?
As for the Lathe, i have a tailstock chuck but no key  ::), and i still need to get around to paying you a visit!


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:33:24 PM
So now i `have something that looks like this... well actualy i have this....... ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:41:12 PM
Almost there now.
The welding tip needs to screw in the end, and i need to cross drill the gas holes and then pretty it up before bending to shape, but time caught up with me, so more on this later.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Clive on February 07, 2010, 06:45:58 PM
Wouldn't the easier option be not to weld the tip to the wire!?!?!?!?! :D :D :D :D

Clive


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 07, 2010, 06:48:27 PM
Yeah yeah yeah, you`ll see, you`ve got all this to come  ;D ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: andbolt0 on February 07, 2010, 09:38:07 PM
when setin up set the wire speed slightly faster and hold the torch a bit further awayalso anti spatter spray into the shroud  helps andy


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Manky Monkey on February 08, 2010, 12:01:17 AM
Yeah, weld spatter up me nozzle's my biggest problem.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Hagar on February 08, 2010, 12:08:01 AM
Yeah, weld spatter up me nozzle's my biggest problem.

Todays Top Tip   ......  Never whipe your nozzle on their curtains  ......   ;D


  ..  Hagar  ..   ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: hunter on February 08, 2010, 09:21:53 AM
I use my sleeve, ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: madron on February 08, 2010, 10:53:08 PM
for about £6 ya can buy anti spatter spray stops wire  stickin to nozzles save ya time n money


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Manky Monkey on February 09, 2010, 10:07:15 AM
Yeah, seen it, even used it a couple of times. Never gotten round to buying any. I'm a lazy Monkey.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: cunningplan on February 09, 2010, 06:46:11 PM
A place I used to weld for had tins of what looks like wax, every so often I just dipped the nozzle in and I had no problems


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: gazzagood on February 09, 2010, 08:46:12 PM
A place I used to weld for had tins of what looks like wax, every so often I just dipped the nozzle in and I had no problem

that will be tip dip i use it all the time and anti spatter great stuff


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: hunter on February 09, 2010, 11:50:19 PM
Like this.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MIG-WELDING-TORCH-TIP-DIP-ANTI-SPATTER-PASTE-500g-TIN_W0QQitemZ310190100601QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_3?hash=item4838c55079


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Manky Monkey on February 10, 2010, 12:07:34 AM
Brilliant! Never heard of that before.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: cunningplan on February 10, 2010, 02:27:54 AM
Like this.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MIG-WELDING-TORCH-TIP-DIP-ANTI-SPATTER-PASTE-500g-TIN_W0QQitemZ310190100601QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_3?hash=item4838c55079

Thats the stuff, it was better when the nossle was hot, dip it in, give it couple of shakes and start welding again.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:34:34 PM
So thats not how to break `em  ::).
And now back to how to make one......
First a slight problem involving camera batteries, so we pick up visualy with me having drilled the now tube out to 4.5mm to a depth of 8mm. This second drilling makes the hole 0.5mm bigger and will be about right to tap to a 5mm thread, so thats what i did and then screwed a tip in the end.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:41:48 PM
Did you spot the 8mm nut screwed on the tube? That`s there because i want to remove some of the thread at the front of the tube, unscrewing the nut when i`ve done will re-cut the start of the thread.
Now, i`ve mounted the tube in my lathe, this is not important, all i need is a way of spinning the tube, a drill, mounted in a vice would do just as well. Starting with a file, i carefully removed most of the unwanted thread section, by moving the file along as the tube was spinning.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:43:31 PM
Then it can be finished off by useing different grades of wet n dry paper.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:48:42 PM
And after a while you should be able to get it nice and smooth, you dont have to do this, i cant see why leaving it fully threaded would effect how it works, but its up to you.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:52:43 PM
Next job is to cross drill it, this allows your shielding gas into the shroud and towards the tip. In my `pattern`, the holes are 1.5mm and located 12mm from the end of the tube, so this is where i drilled them.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 05:57:25 PM
So now i have this......


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 11, 2010, 06:02:23 PM
all thats left to do now is put a bend into it, but it got to cold in the shed so i`ll do that tomorrow  ::).

Cost of buying a new swan neck.....£11.00
Cost of a bit of brass bar ...............£1.50
Cost of fixing a machine with parts you`ve manufactured yourself..........priceless  ;D ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Manky Monkey on February 11, 2010, 08:20:31 PM
Ooh, I do hate talented people!


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 12, 2010, 10:46:47 AM
Me too, glad i`m only basic  ;D.
hopefully that`ll be the last time the lathe is used as a holding device, with a bit of luck i`ll be using it as a lathe this year  ;)


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: TwistedPatience on February 13, 2010, 02:57:53 AM
Hooorah! ;D


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 17, 2010, 04:34:04 PM
While i was in the shed today i thought i may as well get this finished.
Just need to put a slight bend in the neck, so its held in the vice, needed more leverage so i slipped the end of a spanner over the neck and gently bent it forward, suppose i should have heated the brass first but it bent ok without snapping.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 17, 2010, 04:35:02 PM
and there we have it.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: Manky Monkey on February 17, 2010, 07:59:57 PM
Interesting TB. We'll nick that for the tech pages of the main site if you don't mind.
Every little project like that can teach someone something, even if it's just good workshop practices.


Title: Re: neck ache!
Post by: tbone on February 19, 2010, 09:49:49 PM
Carry on boss. Good workshop practices? not sure about that though  ::)